HELP! i'm in choreography hell

[kungfudan]

Hi im danny from sky ones fightschool.Im also part of a stunt team www.dmax.cjb.net.
Im directing my third short film a sequel called THE JADE 2 to be released by Crash Cinema.Iv shot most of the the action with the rest of the stunt team and they are fine but with the final fight i go toe to toe with my fellow work colleaue,a 24 stone doorman.Thing is iv givin him moves to the best of his abilities but throughout the whole fight its mainly me attacking him while he just absorbs the blows.The fight is now finished but i feel the fight just does'nt quite tick.The main problem is he has a bad back and knee so he cannot fall or even fall to his knees which causes problems with the last strike that is supposed to take him down.eg jet vs black dude in kiss or jackie in battle creek brawl are prime examples of bad pair ups.The fight right now feels more like a hollywood punch up rather than the other fights which have hk intensity.Saving this fight means saving the entire film and i promise you indie fans will love it as long as i save this end fight.Someone help!!!!!

[DragonfighterX]

Well first off, I don't think that guy needs to be fighting if he has a bad back and knees.

Are there any other characters you can substitute for the main villain? If not, why not just continue the story after the "end" fight. That way you can have sort of a twist ending. Just when they think it's over, there are new enemies to fight!

[limubai2000]

Scrap the fight and re-shoot with a new stunt guy (if cost effective).

More planning should have been to ensure that the stuntman could perform said stunts. This situation should have never come up but accidents/injuries can and do happen. From the context of your post it sounds as if the stunt man has a lingering injury or 'condition'. Maybe he should not be a stuntman?

I like Dragon's idea... get the hero tired with beating this big guy and then I can visualize it now... the hero panting and sweating... leaning against a wall maybe.. and then a mess of new bad guys show up!

[kungfudan]

thanks dragon and twilight,but what i did not stress was that he is not a stunt man and this fight is his first ever.There is no way im scrapping the fight since it lasts about 3 min which took forever to shoot mainly due to his reactions and iv fought everyone in the team already plus the story needs to have this character fight.Anyway cheers for the advice,you'll understand when you see da film.THE JADE 2.:rollin

[DragonfighterX]

Good luck! Can't wait to see it; did you say Crash was putting it out as part of their "Indy Crash" line?


PS> I checked out your guys demo vid, and you have some impressive moves!

[d max doug]

Iv got it Danny ill stand on Bens shoulders and ware his cloths and we will pull of a butterfly twist.
Lol.
:lol :rollin

[kungfudan]

ha ha very funny doug.never mind the jokes, when are we gonna finish da hockey fight you little @#%$.I swear.(doug plays my brother in THE JADE 2)

[d max doug]

When I have time big brother you #~]}{?%& lol:rollin

[kungfudan]

wheres ur respect for the elders,have i not taught u any martial conduct.3 hour horse stance for u my boy.

[resevoir]

Hey kungfu dan. If you have the option to reshoot then I would say do that.
Try to rearrange the choreography so that your bad knee man emphasizes his size and stregth. to take away the audiences eyes from his lack of techniques, add power to your own reactions. Play with your settings, fall into tables and beams, cut them so they break away, adding power, and put powder on them to emphasize.
for your big guy, use over the should shots looking down at you, and from you point of view shoot bottom to top, if he just absords hits that is cool. but try to mix it up. have him crack his neck, or have him stalk you jason style, and you throw things at him and he bats them away easily. as for his final take downs. use pads, keep them out of frame so he can fall on a soft surface . put down lots of powder so you get a dust cloud when he falls. set the camera at the edge of your pads so it seems like you are shooting from the pint of view of a cockroach. if you can get him to jump a little and land on the pads, then get a slow motion of him in the air.
if you must get him falling to his knees, then just cut up the shots. start with a full body shot. do your technique and have him falling down as far as he can, you can even cheat the camera up as he falls to give more motion and power to the move,
your next shot can be his face, have him act some painful expression, and then a half body shot that starts with him already on his knees. start the shot with his knees, see if he can wear knee pads and then have him go down a little from just above the floor. then pan the camera up revealing his body kneeling. do this on a baby tripod, as hand held may ruin the feeling of the shot and not allow you to catch his expression fully, make sure he shows his pain, if that is what you want.
also if you have a dude that has bad rythym and technique use half body shots, and also remember that our only real control in "making" a final film is editing. You don't have to show the whole movement. if you speed up the rythym and use fast cuts you can give energy to a so so performance.
my two cents
good luck man!!

[kungfudan]

cheers resevoir,u seem to know quite a bit,have i seen your work b4?Most of the stuff u mention has been done already,we talk the same language.RESPECT.

[resevoir]

Don't know if you have seen any of my work. always a boost to the ego when you hear that. Just gave you simple textbook stuff.
watch loads of movies and try to figure out shots. one can never overuse the slow motion button. " Steal, but steal from the best" I like that quote, no clue who said it by the way, but it is the industry standard, just watch any of tarantino's films

as far as respect. That goes out to everyone strugglin' to get their ideas made. More respect to those who have done it.
Hope your movie kicks but man.

[BeardFilms]

Sounds to me like you should recast your villian >D
Thats the best advise that I can give ya anyway