seeking recommendations

[bengs]

hello, i'm just beginning to search further into the Shaw brothers catalogue and was seeking some recommendations

i generally enjoy darker, more violent movies, whether they are period films or contemporary crime/police dramas

some examples of films of this nature that i enjoyed include 'boxer from shantung', 'man of iron', 'the teahouse', 'killer constable'; films that i haven't seen yet but i have read about elsewhere included 'vengeance' (david chiang), 'men from the gutter', 'brothers from the walled city'

further, it might be a long shot but i wonder if there are any shaw brothers films that could be considered an equivalent to the works of some notable Japanese directors such as Seijun Suzuki or Kinji Fukusaku, not necessarily in terms of direction but atmosphere, chaotic action etc. for example along the lines of "youth of the beast", "battles without honor and humanity"

any suggestions would be appreciated.

thanks for your help

[Sandpalm79]

hello, i'm just beginning to search further into the Shaw brothers catalogue and was seeking some recommendations

i generally enjoy darker, more violent movies, whether they are period films or contemporary crime/police dramas

some examples of films of this nature that i enjoyed include 'boxer from shantung', 'man of iron', 'the teahouse', 'killer constable'; films that i haven't seen yet but i have read about elsewhere included 'vengeance' (david chiang), 'men from the gutter', 'brothers from the walled city'

further, it might be a long shot but i wonder if there are any shaw brothers films that could be considered an equivalent to the works of some notable Japanese directors such as Seijun Suzuki or Kinji Fukusaku, not necessarily in terms of direction but atmosphere, chaotic action etc. for example along the lines of "youth of the beast", "battles without honor and humanity"

any suggestions would be appreciated.

thanks for your help

When you say Darker, id 100% agree with Vengeance

masked avengers
flag of iron
five elemental ninja

Id have to say that chang cheh is the master of dark violent films. liu chia liang ( 36th chamber) has a more lighthearted style etc

hope this helps@!

[bengs]

sandpalm thanks, yes these suggestions are what i wanted

Chang Cheh has so many other movies i don't know where to start

yes i did list 'vengeance' but unfortunately i haven't seen it yet because i can't find any DVDs for purchase, all out of stock, and i don't want to get a bootleg with english dub.. funimation or tokyo shock or one of those companies should re-release it

[Morgoth Bauglir]

Some great dark SB films out there. My favorite kind of movie. Killer Constable is definitely one of the darkest. Here’s some others-

What Price Honesty?
Avenging Eagle
Eight Diagram Pole Fighter
HK Godfather
Bells of Death
Intimiate Confessions of a Chinese Courtesan
The Kiss of Death
The Master Strikes Back
Human Lanterns
The Blood Brothers
Delightful Forest
Soul of the Sword
Duel for Gold
Iron Chain Assassin
Seeding of a Ghost (non martial arts)

[Athena]

Some great dark SB films out there. My favorite kind of movie. Killer Constable is definitely one of the darkest. Here’s some others-

What Price Honesty?
Avenging Eagle
Eight Diagram Pole Fighter
HK Godfather
Bells of Death
Intimiate Confessions of a Chinese Courtesan
The Kiss of Death
The Master Strikes Back
Human Lanterns
The Blood Brothers
Delightful Forest
Soul of the Sword
Duel for Gold
Iron Chain Assassin
Seeding of a Ghost (non martial arts)

Great list Morgoth !!
The best of the best of them are :
Soul of the Sword ! Seeding of a Ghost ! Intimate Confessions of a Chinese Courtesan ! Human Lanterns ! & Killer Constable !!

Blood Brothers was not that DARK too me..Maybe Warlords ( remake ) but not BB ...

BTW Morgoth , your signature picture is mystagogueing :tongue:again ...

Xiexie Athena ..♥

[bengs]

Morgoth thank you for the list, I will take a look at those

Any more suggestions will be appreciated

[Morgoth Bauglir]

Your list is good Athena, I admit, but my list (of my list) of the darkest of the dark is better:xd:

What Price Honesty (the one that tops them all)
HK Godfather
Killer Constable (the one you managed to get right:angel:)
The Master Strikes Back (not much fighting, and even the fighting that is there isn't that great. But damn it is dark!)

[Fang Shih-yu]

@Morgoth: Don't forget The Delinquent! The last part of it is very dark, especially the unforgettable ending!:squigglemouth:

[Morgoth Bauglir]

@Morgoth: Don't forget The Delinquent! The last part of it is very dark, especially the unforgettable ending!:squigglemouth:

There are some Shaws (actually a couple hundred) that I haven't seen. :yociexp110:

[Fang Shih-yu]

There are some Shaws (actually a couple hundred) that I haven't seen. :yociexp110:OK! It was co-directed by Chang Cheh and Kuei Chi-hung; the latter guy directed The Killer Snakes and Corpsemania! Both directors' styles are palpably seen here, and Wang Chung gives a very noteworthy performance!

You'll see it someday, no doubt!:wink:

I've a ways to go on watching Shaws, compared to you! I still haven't even tried a full-blown Chinese opera yet!:tongue:

[venoms5]

HUMAN LANTERNS
WHAT PRICE HONESTY
KILLER CONSTABLE
THE DELINQUENT
FLYING GUILLOTINE 2
THE MASTER STRIKES BACK
AVENGING EAGLE
THE CASINO
SECRET SERVICE OF THE IMPERIAL COURT
THE JADE TIGER
DUEL FOR GOLD
THE DUEL
VENGEANCE!
THE ANONYMOUS HEROES (Starts out as a light hearted action movie with a bit of violence, but turns deadly serious at the end)
MEN FROM THE GUTTER
THE KISS OF DEATH
LOST SOULS
THE EIGHT DIAGRAM POLE FIGHTER

[bengs]

Thank you all for your suggestions, especially with "The Delinquent", thats one I was thinking of but couldn't remember the name, and the likes of "Men from the Gutter" as aforementioned.

I prefer these type of movies over the comedy-kung fu actioners, which is why I am missing many films that others may consider seminal to the genre overall.

[greenfan]

If you have not already, you HAVE TO, HAVE TO get on 'What Price Honesty?' and 'Secret Service of the Imperial Court'.

If you want dark exploitation grimyness then I wholeheartedly recommend 'Big Bad Sis'. Excellent film directed by Sun Chung - did the man ever make a bad film?

[bengs]

If you have not already, you HAVE TO, HAVE TO get on 'What Price Honesty?' and 'Secret Service of the Imperial Court'.

If you want dark exploitation grimyness then I wholeheartedly recommend 'Big Bad Sis'. Excellent film directed by Sun Chung - did the man ever make a bad film?


Thanks, yes I have the first two you mentioned. I don't think I got through "What Price Honesty" yet but have seen "Secret Service of the Imperial Court". Haven't seen "Big Bad Sis".

[Iron Boat]

Some great dark SB films out there. My favorite kind of movie. Killer Constable is definitely one of the darkest. Here’s some others-

What Price Honesty?
Avenging Eagle
Eight Diagram Pole Fighter
HK Godfather
Bells of Death
Intimiate Confessions of a Chinese Courtesan
The Kiss of Death
The Master Strikes Back
Human Lanterns
The Blood Brothers
Delightful Forest
Soul of the Sword
Duel for Gold
Iron Chain Assassin
Seeding of a Ghost (non martial arts)Great List, I might even throw in a few One Armed Swordsman films and Black Tavern based on mood. Also if you like Chen Kuan Tai in particular pick up Iron Monkey '77, Big Boss of Shanghai, The Flying Guillotine and Opium and the Kung Fu Master.

[Morgoth Bauglir]

Some more good dark older non shaws-

Love and Sword
Iron Swallow
Sixty Second Assassin
Iron Dragon Strikes Back
The Damned
Tiger Over Wall
The Sword (both the Wang Yu and Adam Cheng versions)
King of Kings
Writing Kung Fu
The Master and the Kid
Shaolin Traitor
Rebellious Reign
Postman Strikes Back
Heroes of Shaolin
Undaunted Wudang

[bengs]

Great List, I might even throw in a few One Armed Swordsman films and Black Tavern based on mood. Also if you like Chen Kuan Tai in particular pick up Iron Monkey '77, Big Boss of Shanghai, The Flying Guillotine and Opium and the Kung Fu Master.

Thank you, yes Chen Kuan Tai is probably my favourite Shaw Brothers actor. I have "Big Boss of Shanghai" but yet to see the others.

[bengs]

Some more good dark older non shaws-

Love and Sword
Iron Swallow
Sixty Second Assassin
Iron Dragon Strikes Back
The Damned
Tiger Over Wall
The Sword (both the Wang Yu and Adam Cheng versions)
King of Kings
Writing Kung Fu
The Master and the Kid
Shaolin Traitor
Rebellious Reign
Postman Strikes Back
Heroes of Shaolin
Undaunted Wudang

Thank you again Morgoth for more recommendations. I've only seen two of those.

[KyFi]

hello, i'm just beginning to search further into the Shaw brothers catalogue and was seeking some recommendations

i generally enjoy darker, more violent movies, whether they are period films or contemporary crime/police dramas

some examples of films of this nature that i enjoyed include 'boxer from shantung', 'man of iron', 'the teahouse', 'killer constable'; films that i haven't seen yet but i have read about elsewhere included 'vengeance' (david chiang), 'men from the gutter', 'brothers from the walled city'

further, it might be a long shot but i wonder if there are any shaw brothers films that could be considered an equivalent to the works of some notable Japanese directors such as Seijun Suzuki or Kinji Fukusaku, not necessarily in terms of direction but atmosphere, chaotic action etc. for example along the lines of "youth of the beast", "battles without honor and humanity"

any suggestions would be appreciated.

thanks for your help

That's funny, as a longtime Shaw fan, it's just been this last year that I've started exploring Nikkatsu action and Seijun Suzuki. Some Shaws that might be along those lines:

set in more modern times:

Vengeance
The Duel
The Savage Five
Five Tough Guys
The Singing Killer

Also, Shaws brought over a couple of Japanese directors who had explicitly worked on Japanese action movies of the 60s---I don't remember the Japanese name of the guy, but I believe the Shaw movie The Black Falcon was one of those movies. I haven't seen it, but it's on my list and I think it might be similar to what you're looking for.

Here's The Singing Killer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzKz9oV54Qw

For period pieces that might have a similar vibe:

Have Sword, Will Travel
Duel for Gold
Soul of the Sword
Avenging Eagle

[Iron Boat]

Thank you, yes Chen Kuan Tai is probably my favourite Shaw Brothers actor. I have "Big Boss of Shanghai" but yet to see the others.We are in agreement, CKT is also my favorite Shaw Star, Iron Monkey ranks with Boxer From Shantung imo, in addition to the films I mentioned also take a look at the Bloody Escape and Iron Fists (Shaolin King Boxer)

[bengs]

We are in agreement, CKT is also my favorite Shaw Star, Iron Monkey ranks with Boxer From Shantung imo, in addition to the films I mentioned also take a look at the Bloody Escape and Iron Fists (Shaolin King Boxer)

Yes, I will do that, I hope I can fill my collection with more of his films as money permits. "Boxer from Shantung" is a classic. Thanks for your recommendations.

[bengs]

That's funny, as a longtime Shaw fan, it's just been this last year that I've started exploring Nikkatsu action and Seijun Suzuki. Some Shaws that might be along those lines:

set in more modern times:

Vengeance
The Duel
The Savage Five
Five Tough Guys
The Singing Killer

Also, Shaws brought over a couple of Japanese directors who had explicitly worked on Japanese action movies of the 60s---I don't remember the Japanese name of the guy, but I believe the Shaw movie The Black Falcon was one of those movies. I haven't seen it, but it's on my list and I think it might be similar to what you're looking for.

Here's The Singing Killer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzKz9oV54Qw

For period pieces that might have a similar vibe:

Have Sword, Will Travel
Duel for Gold
Soul of the Sword
Avenging Eagle

Thanks, yes this is one of the reasons for my post, aside from my interest in Japanese films of that period, I heard some Japanese directors might have worked on Shaw films but I don't have any names to go with and I didn't consider that their names would be translated into Chinese.

So the director of "Black Falcon" Furukawa Takumi did "Cruel Gun Story" with Joe Shishido, and also did another Shaw film called "Kiss and Kill", but it seems to be unreleased?

Anybody know of other Japanese directors that worked on Shaw films? Would be interesting to see.

On a side note, as a James Bond fan I hope I'll get around to seeing all these James Bond ripoffs they produced.

Thanks again.

[Morgoth Bauglir]

bengs I'l try to make this my last post on this thread so that you don't have to spend too much money:tongue: Just wondering if you have seen Rendezvous with Death. Chen Kuan Tai is amazing in it. Without him I think the movie would have been just a little above average, but because of him I consider it a great movie.

[bengs]

Morgoth, please keep sharing your recommendations, I am saving a list. Obviously I can't afford everything but it gives me an idea if I want to order more in future. I have heard of that film and will consider it.

[Iron Boat]

RwD is my fav Wang Yu flic.Really!? All I ever think when I watch it is how much better it would be without Wang Yu, with that said I did like him a lot in Proud Youth, my favorite Wang Yu flic.

[Morgoth Bauglir]

Yeah Sun Chung's direction is very good. Wong Yu was ok. Not great, not terrible, but I don't think he fit the role that well. He's much better in a movie like Kid with a Tattoo.

[Iron Boat]

I think it's Sun Chungs direction for the movie that does it for me. Proud Youth is also up there on the better W Yu flics for me.

Sad he is no longer with us tho....Agreed RIP Wang Yu,

I didn't think much of Lo Leih's character in RWD either, seemed he was just going through the motions of that type of beggar character. Chen Kuan Tai however was brilliant. If only he could of worked more often with Sun Chung.

[make believe]

If you want dark exploitation grimyness then I wholeheartedly recommend 'Big Bad Sis'. Excellent film directed by Sun Chung - did the man ever make a bad film?

I never even heard of this one but reading the description now I really want to see it.

The same goes for all the other recommendations as well. There is too many films I have yet to see. It gets to be so overwhelming. Damn you all!

[The Silver Fox]

I just watched 'The Rescue' it is a period actioner from '71. Very violent film for it's time,buckets and buckets of blood,lots of primitive but effective wirework. It stars Lo Lieh and Shih Szu. I've had this for awhile and was not expecting much, but I thoroughly enjoyed it.

[bengs]

I just watched 'The Rescue' it is a period actioner from '71. Very violent film for it's time,buckets and buckets of blood,lots of primitive but effective wirework. It stars Lo Lieh and Shih Szu. I've had this for awhile and was not expecting much, but I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Thanks for the recommendation, that is one I have considered. The three Shaw actors who I have pursued to date are Chen Kuan Tai, Lo Lieh and Danny Lee Sau Yin.

[bengs]

I never even heard of this one but reading the description now I really want to see it.

The same goes for all the other recommendations as well. There is too many films I have yet to see. It gets to be so overwhelming. Damn you all!

Definitely, too much to discover. I tend to only pursue films by specific actors at this point otherwise I would have too much to go through.

An example is with Danny Lee Sau Yin's films; him alone I have about 20 titles most of which is various Fortune Star VCDs and some of his later films up to "Red River". I only have 2 or 3 Shaw films with him so a long way to go.

The other limitation in what I collect though is that I'm not very interested in romance or comedies, regardless of who is in it. Also I skip releases that don't have any english translation.

[Morgoth Bauglir]

bengs you seen Asian Connection? Best Danny lee movie I have seen. I was blown away by it. Do you have a favorite Danny Lee movie?

[bengs]

bengs you seen Asian Connection? Best Danny lee movie I have seen. I was blown away by it. Do you have a favorite Danny Lee movie?

I have in the past tried but been unable to find a copy of Asian Connection with english subtitles. I picked up a DVD that had been misadvertised, then I found a VCD that indicated on the package as having subtitles, but no such thing. Any suggestion where I should get it from?

Favourite Danny Lee movie; well let me say first that as much as I enjoy crime/thrillers, some of his later films, especially during the 80s and early 90s (namely the aforementioned Fortune Star re-releases) became a bit repetitive in plot and the progress of the film in general. I enjoy them, but just thought its important to point that out.

In consideration of what I have seen to date though, my favourites were "Law With Two Phases" and "Murderer Pursues".

[Morgoth Bauglir]

I've had Law With Two Phases on DVDR for awhile. I'm gonna have to watch it soon.

I don't know what the best version is of Asian connection. This is the English subtitled version I watched- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0W5uNpK-uQ

[bengs]

I've had Law With Two Phases on DVDR for awhile. I'm gonna have to watch it soon.

I don't know what the best version is of Asian connection. This is the English subtitled version I watched- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0W5uNpK-uQ

Oh.. thanks alot.. I wouldn't have found that otherwise. It sounds like Danny Lee's voice in the film as well.

Just curious (sorry for going off the topic), have you watched "Undeclared War"? Not the best story but interesting for its significance, being that it was an attempt to take Danny Lee to the international audience with a big action film.

[Morgoth Bauglir]

That's one of the few Ringo Lam movies i haven't seen. I'll have to check it out.

[bengs]

That's one of the few Ringo Lam movies i haven't seen. I'll have to check it out.

I see. I hope you will enjoy it. I haven't watched it for a while, I should take a look again soon.

At the moment I am watching "Murderer Pursues" again. This is a great film. Simple story, good acting for what it is, and the music used works well.

[P'an ku]

Thanks for the recommendation, that is one I have considered. The three Shaw actors who I have pursued to date are Chen Kuan Tai, Lo Lieh and Danny Lee Sau Yin.

You have your work cut out for you with Lo Lieh. He made about 170 films between 1965 and 1985.

One very grim film that I don't see in this thread is Oath of Death, the first film directed by Pao Hsueh Lieh. This is one of my favorite Lo Lieh roles and one of the most violent Shaw Brothers films I've seen. Pao also co-directed Man of Iron, Delightful Forest, Boxer from Shantung and Iron Bodyguard with Chang Cheh. He directed The Shadow Boxer, as well, which is another dark film.

Sadly when Pao left Shaw Brothers for Taiwan in 1978 the quality of his films declined, I guess, due to the low budgets he had to work with.

[bengs]

You have your work cut out for you with Lo Lieh. He made about 170 films between 1965 and 1985.

One very grim film that I don't see in this thread is Oath of Death, the first film directed by Pao Hsueh Lieh. This is one of my favorite Lo Lieh roles and one of the most violent Shaw Brothers films I've seen. Pao also co-directed Man of Iron, Delightful Forest, Boxer from Shantung and Iron Bodyguard with Chang Cheh. He directed The Shadow Boxer, as well, which is another dark film.

Sadly when Pao left Shaw Brothers for Taiwan in 1978 the quality of his films declined, I guess, due to the low budgets he had to work with.

Thanks for your input. Yes, a Lo Lieh collection will not come easily, but if something catches my eye I would consider it, such as the film you mentioned.