Dragon Dynasty Police Story

[The Running Man]

I wrote a review up of the disc over at the Asian DVD Guide.

Here's the link if anyone of you want to read it. :)

Link (http://adg.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=1032&pid=14416&st=120&#entry14416)

[limubai2000]

Thanks, it's on my purchase list for this month.

I have the Universe disk and the FS remastered boxset so this will be a nice addition.

I hope they get the video issues sorted out, with the kind of cash they have and the catalog of disks coming it would be a same to see My Young Auntie at any less quality than the Celestial/IVL disk for example.

Do we know if DD has OAS or Secret Service Imperial Court?

[MacLeod613]

How would you compare DD's to Deltamac's?

[kermit]

The DD Police Story looks pretty crappy to me. I'll stick with my IVL boxset. I really couldn't give a rat's ass about mono, i have a stereo telly and 5.1 surround sound.

Oh, and from those screencaps of Iron Monkey, i think the HKL picture looks much nicer.

[David G Rees]

Trouble is 5.1 mixes normally add crappy sound fx which spoil it...Warriors Two being a prime example...if a film was originally released and mixed in mono it should have that option on the dvd.
The HKL Police Story is good enough for me, i would rather buy a new film than double dip all the time...

[limubai2000]

I just scored DD Police Story today at my local Kmart and I'll go with previous, the picture on my IVL boxset looks nicer.

Running Man's review very accurate as far as the video is concerned.

[morgoth]

Is Police Story at Best Buy? QUICK, please tell me!

[morgoth]

come on

I only have about an hour left here at the library.

[morgoth]

COME ON!!!!

[The Running Man]

It would be at Bestbuy on it's official date on tuesday.

[killer meteor]

The DD Police Story looks pretty crappy to me. I'll stick with my IVL boxset. I really couldn't give a rat's ass about mono, i have a stereo telly and 5.1 surround sound.

Isn't that like saying you have a colour TV so you couldn't give a rat's ass about black and white. It's attitudes like this that have led to so many great films being destroyed by remixes

[kermit]

No, black and white can look glorious. Mono quality soundtracks always sound crummy.

[Markgway]

Ignore the Frog. Mono rules.

[Linn1]

the worse release of a film I've seen in a long time. The quality of the image is VERY poor compared to IVL or even the old New Line tape.

[chen lung]

old Dimension tape.
New Line released it, not Dimension.

Is it really that bad (aside from pinkification and obvious inferiority to New Line's version):\ :o ?

[Linn1]

they should be ashamed that a seven or eight year old tape looks better than their current release with a HD master to work with. This release really looked bad to me and I'm not picky in the least. There's more grain here than I've seen in most 70s films on DVD. If it didn't have the DD logo, I would think it was a Tai Seng release. Really.

[sevenhooks]

Ignore the Frog. Mono rules.

[morgoth]

I would say it is much sharper than a Tai Seng release but I was definitely a bit dissapointed.

[HAZ74]

Picture on this looks bad. Maybe it was rushed to get out or quality control dropped the ball?

peace

h

[killer meteor]

It's the tampering with the colour that bugs me.

[Chinatown Kid]

Guess I'll be sticking with my HKL's version for now then.

[The Running Man]

Picture on this looks bad. Maybe it was rushed to get out or quality control dropped the ball?

Read my review. I've established that Brian White, former head of HKLs, has no idea what he is doing when he is doing video transfers. In his HKL days he has been screwing up transfers all the time and now that he is hooked up with Harvey Weinstein it could mean a turn for the worst as we will never see HK films look that great again as long as this company owns the rights to it.

[monk sante]

this is not a good sign, I thought the Police Story dvd would be the best available. Thank god I still have my HKL dvd.
This really sucks!:|

[Markgway]

I'm REALLY sorry that Fox never released these.

[drunkenmantis13]

Is there anything on the dvd making it worth the purchase if i have the IVL boxset?
Extras, Dub...?

[chen lung]

Quite a few things...

[The Running Man]

Is there anything on the dvd making it worth the purchase if i have the IVL boxset?

Read my review. :)

[FarEastPirate]

The Dragon Dynasty has nice extras but the Video quality on the film is awful, the old megastar DVD's are better quality

[morgoth]

Tough call if the movie is worth it for the extras.

[killer meteor]

It looks to me like besides the pinking, they fiddled with the contrast, resulting in blooming whites and so on. The HKL Fist Of Fury and Wheels On Meals have this problem too. I never had much faith in White - he cropped Snake In The Eagle's Shadow and Drunken Master to increase their marketbility to teenagers and claimed that most of the nation's DVD players couldn't handle 2.35:1

[gfanikf]

Well warts and all I'm going to pick it up today. I have a dvd-r of the IVL and I'm more interested in the extras since the IVL didn't really have any. Still I wish they would sort these issues out for future releases.

[limubai2000]

They should use the Buena Vista guys for the mastering, those guys are supposedly the best in Hollywood if not the world.

[chen lung]

...wouldn't be possible as they can only use what FS provides (their own approved restoration) so they wouldn't be able to have access to film prints. I'm sure when it comes to titles maybe owned by Mei Ah or whatever could do restoration by themselves.

True, Buena Vista has great video restorations (probably the only good thing about them at the time) and I would have personally preferred to have seen it done too.

[The Running Man]

...wouldn't be possible as they can only use what FS provides (their own approved restoration)

That isn't true.

DD messed up the existing Police Story print FS provided. That's why the IVL release looks better than DD's.

And it isn't the source print that really counts. It's who is doing what to the source print that is the determining factor.

True, Buena Vista has great video restorations (probably the only good thing about them at the time)

Only good thing about them? Surely you don't forget that it was Harvey Weinstein that forced alterations upon these films. Not Buena Vista.

And honestly, any US studio is better than Brian White and his team.

Look at the hacked up releases of Hitman, High Risk, and New Legend of Shaolin. Although disturbed by Columbia, it was some Z Grade studio (Silver Nitrate), that is connected with underground rap, that produced those versions and the colors on those prints are gorgeous. Their Contract Killer video kills HKLs crappy release.

[chen lung]

That isn't true.
How is it not?

DD messed up the existing Police Story print FS provided. That's why the IVL release looks better than DD's.
We know that.

Surely you don't forget that it was Harvey Weinstein that forced alterations upon these films. Not Buena Vista.
We're not talking about the alterations or who personally wanted it.

And honestly, any US studio is better than Brian White and his team.
Sure...

Look at the hacked up releases of Hitman, High Risk, and New Legend of Shaolin. Although disturbed by Columbia, it was some Z Grade studio (Silver Nitrate), that is connected with underground rap, that produced those versions and the colors on those prints are gorgeous.
The 'New Legend of Shaolin' version is OK but rather disappointing. Check out my comparison (http://www.bulletsnbabesdvd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2705) where even the lowly Universe has an advantage.

[The Running Man]

How is it not?

How isn't it? Read the reply.


We know that.

Then you must of forgot because if you knew that you wouldn't have written your comment in the first place.

We're not talking about the alterations or who personally wanted it.

Read what I quoted from you and you'll know why I wrote that comment.

Sure...

Are you being sarcastic here? I can't tell.

The 'New Legend of Shaolin' version is OK but rather disappointing. Check out my comparison where even the lowly Universe has an advantage.

Cause it's brighter? Baahh...the anamorphic image still kills all other versions on the market right now.

Compare HKL's Hitman to Contract Killer. HKL looks like crap. Even Mei Ah's remastered release is better than the HKL DVD.

[chen lung]

How isn't it? Read the reply.
Now I understand.

From what limubai2000 said, I kinda thought he meant working from scratch (directly from a print) which is why I said about DD only being able to use whatever FS gives them. Media Asia seemed to be the opposite in which case, they actually supplied prints and the distributors themselves performed the restoration to it.

With this already-prepared source, there isn't much you can do other than artificially fix colours up to a limited extent if you were attemping to match New Line's quality (if you're working with a digital source) which has obviously gone disasterously here (also with the boosted contrasts).

Read what I quoted from you and you'll know why I wrote that comment.
There was nothing wrong with the video's quality and the only alterations Buena Vista did were the audio and obviously re-editing (Harvey re-edited, Brian changed the colours - different issues and the former doesn't apply here).

Are you being sarcastic here? I can't tell.
Yeah I was.

Cause it's brighter? Baahh...the anamorphic image still kills all other versions on the market right now.
The sides were chopped off and blowed up (check out how fatter Wong Jing looks:b ). The capture with Xiao Miu and the other kid - colours look awful (blend-in too easily).

Compare HKL's Hitman to Contract Killer. HKL looks like crap. Even Mei Ah's remastered release is better than the HKL DVD.
I believe you, but I can't as I only have the HKL DVD. Can you provide screencaptures anyway (would be interesting to see)?

Thanks:)

[The Running Man]

With this already-prepared source, there isn't much you can do other than artificially fix colours up to a limited extent

Is that how White works? Not from prints but just from digital sources?

In any case, it doesn't matter. Even if he wasn't working from an actual print, there is no excuse to make the print look that bad. Only a fool would take the image and make it worse.

And this is how White has been doing it from day one. Making prints look worse and ruining the images than and only cause there was nothing really to compare the prints at the time to, did people hail HKL. That and the fact that the Dimension prints were heavily altered so people unfortunately did not give the images on those prints an honest comparison.

There was nothing wrong with the video's quality and the only alterations Buena Vista did were the audio and obviously re-editing (Harvey re-edited, Brian changed the colours - different issues and the former doesn't apply here).


You said that the only thing about Buena Vista at the time was their video restoration. Are you not implying the altered versions of the films?

Yeah I was.

Too bad for the sarcasm then man...cause it's true. Brian White sucks at video restoration.

The sides were chopped off and blowed up (check out how fatter Wong Jing looks ). The capture with Xiao Miu and the other kid - colours look awful (blend-in too easily).

Yeah, there does seem to be a problem with the image being stretched out a lil. But it's nothing compared to the heavy amount it occurred to on every other HKL release.

And the colors don't look awful my man. That Legend of the Red Dragon print looks like a film that was made yesterday compared to the Universe DVD which makes it look like a movie that was shot in 1982 and found in someone's garage.

I believe you, but I can't as I only have the HKL DVD. Can you provide screencaptures anyway (would be interesting to see)?

That wouldn't be a bad idea. I'll get around to it when I can. :)

[Markgway]

All of those NLOFS caps look poor in different ways. The ENGLISH/FRENCH maybe the sharpest, but the colours are way off. This film still needs a proper release.

[killer meteor]

I always found it ironic that HKL, considering the remix junkies they would become, released genuine 5.1 films like The Blacksheep Affair and Hitman, in mono.

[chen lung]

Is that how White works? Not from prints but just from digital sources?
It can depend... For the Seasonal Films and stuff from Mei Ah, that seemed to be restoration work on HKL's behalf because for the majority; only film prints were available to them.

Colour correction at HKL was often very poor - Examples include 'Big Boss (http://www.geocities.com/imaginepictures2003/bigbossreview.html)' and 'Fist of Fury (http://www.geocities.com/imaginepictures2003/fistoffuryreview.html)'.

But at Fortune Star, DD can only work with more-or-less what's directly given to them (for legal reasons) except what we see here with regards to the pinkification - I'm not entirely familiar with the situation however. Sadly film prints are not an option (unlike what New Line had when Media Asia were still around holding them). Pinkification was definately not nessesery regardless and it does look horrible (along with other adjustments such as the aforementioned contrast that killer meteor brought up and edge enhancement).

FS complete one restoration in HD digitally and then it's passed onto DD e.t.c for easy mastering AFAIK (strangely between Fox/IVL e.t.c and HKL, they sometimes differ in image information. Why - I don't know). Apparantly, the non-remastered ones are taken from beta sources (why not 35mm prints?). Media Asia (who didn't restore anything) supplied prints for Dimension, HKL e.t.c to restore themselves and the results varied.

Dimension often (or always) had the upper hand when it came to the video section with a nice balance of everything (sharpness e.t.c) - just like the TV broadcastings when 'Dragons Forever' came on when it may have looked better than the FS job (would be nice to see a comparison if someone recorded the broadcastings onto a digital source).

HK Video were very good but seemed 'pale' in their presentation (their advantage was minimal cropping and distortion without much sharpness lost but colours were still not very prominent - very good however).

HKL unfortunately 'bled' their presentation with the softness and everything going into each other and nothing standing out. Examples include: cropping and blowing up to compensate, loss of sharpness lost, noise removal (which is vital to help maintain detail and sharpness - 'lazy' restoration often becomes responsible for this) and awkward colour correction.

I'm sure you'll probably know all that but correct me if I'm wrong at any bits;) .

Are you not implying the altered versions of the films?
I was referring to their butchered films which had great video restorations, but everything else was lame. Shame DD didn't have access to film prints as opposed to what FS offered.

I'd like to see a IVL/Spectrum vs DD comparison:) .

And thanks Mark;) .:p

[Linn1]

film print, beta, etc. depends on the film and how much work the company wants to do. HKL would have had the option in most cases to get a film print and remaster it themselves if they wanted. It is cheaper and perhaps better, but more confining, to let FS do the masters. But that also means that you can't change them much once they are delivered. Color and sharpness can usually be changed with a little explaining to the company.

[The Running Man]

Colour correction at HKL was often very poor - Examples include 'Big Boss' and 'Fist of Fury'.


Pretty much every film honestly.

But at Fortune Star, DD can only work with more-or-less what's directly given to them (for legal reasons) except what we see here with regards to the pinkification - I'm not entirely familiar with the situation however. Sadly film prints are not an option (unlike what New Line had when Media Asia were still around holding them).

Well first of all, New Line was actually working from the old US print of the film, not a new Media Asia print. That gives even more embarrassment to DD's crap disaster.

And the "pinkification" is the absolute least of the DD's Police Story's print problems. The colors are completely washed out and at the same time the contrast is forced giving that weird over sharpness look.

And that's the main point here. No matter what the source was, it is obvious that they have total freedom to do what they want with it...and they are making it worse. Brian White does not come from a video restoration background and neither does his team. I wouldn't be surprised if the dude's background was from marketing and sales. A smarter man would hire a professional company to take care of the video. He is not a professional in that field and should know better. He doesn't know what he is doing plain and simple. I remember coming across something online where White said that Crime Story was meant to look like a documentary and thus that's why he made the HKL print look all grainy and washed out. Uhhhh....no....it isn't supposed to look like that at ALL and he ended up making the worse print of that film on the market.

The real problem here though is since he has that Weinstein connection. Like I mentioned, at least he had people that knew what they were doing when he was back at Miramax/Dimension. But now that he has given control over to White, now many of these films will never look as they should look ever. It doesn't help that many of these reviewers are totally ignorant of this and give good marks to the Police Story discs. I have come across some online, not to mention Mark Pollard's review, that do so and their ignorance is making the situation worse.

If White is not made aware of this issue and does something about it, I will not hesitate to make a petition and spread the word. Seriously, at least when White was only at HKL there were other options. But now with Weinstein they are going to be spreading to other markets with this garbage.


PS

Scott and Mark
If you think the Universe disc of New Legend of Shaolin is superior to the Legend of the Red Dragon print...you're both cuckoo. :b

[Markgway]

Re. New Legend/Red Dragon.

I'm just going by those caps on the link.

I never said that the Universe was better... where??

Just that the colours are off on the Paramount F/E print (if that's identicial to the Col/Tri, I don't know, because I haven't seen it?)

We still need a quality uncut version don't we?

[The Running Man]

Dude...I put a " :b "

I'm not being serious about it so don't worry. ;)

And yeah of course, no matter which looks better, the very fact remains that a quality version of the uncut film is lacking.

[killer meteor]

I recall a few early DVDs from various compaines had this "pinkifcation" problem. My Ghostbusters II DVD from 1999 is an example. Why they did that I don't know.