PDA

View Full Version : Hey guys, I got new DVD of The Sword today....


Linn1
03-11-2007, 07:41 AM
and it's all I had hoped. The quality of the video is very good, better than the previous Crash releases IMO. But I think the print they had here was in better shape. There's some speckles and a splice or two, some smallish subs, but nothing earth shattering. I DID have to adjust my contrast just a bit because it was a little bright, but to be honest I have my TV set bright to watch crappy kung fu video tapes and DVD-Rs. ;)

This is one of my all time fave wuxia films, forget the studio. And this release will blow you away if you're a fan of the film, as the old full screen tape is now retired. This IMO is right up there with some of the best of Jimmy Wang Yu's Shaw Brothers work. And Jimmy, in the snow, with three o'clock shadow...that's magic. The only thing that sucks is they don't have a trailer for the film on the disc. They MAY have it on the other two in this batch, I haven't looked. As for the film, I don't want to ruin anything, but a few bits to think on:

-What's a Jimmy film without a tournament? :) Don't get too excited. It's short, but it's there.

- There's a reason why the HK Film Archive picked this as one of the best wuxias for their swordplay film festival a few years back. Imagine Shaw Brothers period wuxia circa 1970 with a 'touch' of indy, and that's what you have here. The look is certainly Shaw-like, but with some grit and outdoor locations. And I think the sets and costumes are better than the Shaws IMO. Much closer to a look between early 70s SB wuxia and Li Han Hsiang's work in the mid-70s.

-The swords and costumes depicted in the film are authentic for the period and look less "fake" IMO then most films. The writer/director Pan Lei, reportedly spent nearly a year in pre-production to get the look of the film just right.

-Kung fu music fans, listen closely to the music in the credits sequence and throughout the film.

-And finally, after you've seen the movie, see if you can guess what film was a remake.

ironfistedmonk2003
03-11-2007, 09:03 AM
I'm looking forward to this, I've never seen it before and now my interest is piqued.

limubai2000
03-11-2007, 10:05 AM
OMG, thanks Linn. Already on pre-order just counting the days now... :p

VonHumboldtFleischer
03-11-2007, 01:53 PM
Hey, it's nice that this one is getting a decent release. I thought it was a terrific film, although it may disappoint fans of Wang Yu-related carnage. It's a slow-burning movie with a story to tell, and it's a little stilted and studio-bound until Jimmy hits the road about 30m into the movie. Once it gets going, though - and once you resign yourself to the fact that it isn't a film about Jimmy Wang Yu butchering dozens of Japanese goons every five minutes - it's a real pleasure to watch.

Jimmy's performance is excellent - his character is young, spoiled, vain (even a little prissy), and becomes increasingly, dangerously obsessed with a sword that carries a kind of tragic past with it. Actually, come to think of it, it's kind of like watching him go from proud, naive, baby-faced Jimmy in TEMPLE OF THE RED LOTUS to the dark, brooding Silver Roc character in GOLDEN SWALLOW. It's fairly unusual to see this kind of patient, gradual, incremental character development in a martial arts movie.

Of course, the FS version I've got crops the effing subtitles, so you have to do a certain amount of thinkin' and figgerin' to get things clear, and there are times - particularly when the old sword collector's daughter and her portly friend are introduced about 40m into the movie - when you're likely to find yourself a little lost, so thank goodness for a WS version. If the subs are the same as the burnt-in ones in the FS version, you might want to lean close to the screen and get ready to squint, though.

As for the music, I watched this movie about a month ago and only managed to get the god-damned theme out of my head last week. There's an awesome ambush scene, and I swear it plays the same track about four times throughout it. I don't think I've ever heard it in another kung fu movie, although my memory for this kind of thing is notoriously bad.

I have NO idea what movie was a remake of this one. Or do you mean which movie was this a remake of? It actually reminded me of Anthony Mann's western WINCHESTER 73 at times.

Any chance of some screen caps?

gfanikf
03-11-2007, 06:49 PM
Damn Linn got it first :P.

I should be getting mine hopefully on Monday. I'll take caps as soon as I get it.

saltysam
03-13-2007, 08:28 PM
doesn't like the movie or the transfer much

www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/r...p?ID=26974 (http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/read.php?ID=26974)

gfanikf
03-13-2007, 10:05 PM
Honestly I thought it was a piss-poor review from someone who didn't seem to get the genre, but thats just me.

VonHumboldtFleischer
03-13-2007, 10:09 PM
That guy's a moron.

I can't comment on how sparkly clean the new DVD is, but as far as wuxia movies are concerned, this guy doesn't know what he's talking about. "The rest is typical genre stuff of this era." What a maroon. This is easily Jimmy's most atypical, least predictable movie ever (erm, except for FANTASY MISSION FORCE which is beyond bonkers, and that mainland movie he did a cameo as an ox-herder in), and is about as far removed from the usual wuxia formula as you could get. If I were going to compare it to another movie it would be something like BELLS OF DEATH or a King Hu movie - it's that different.

This half-baked poultroon even goes so far as to recommend fast-forwarding the "between bits" (ugh), despite the fact that, in this movie, the "between bits" are really where the story happens. I don't know who this reviewer is, but I hope he falls down and gets scabby knees.

Besides, who are you going to believe, Linn or some ignatz on a website who called the vomitous Matthew McConaughey bucket of schmaltz HOW TO LOSE A GUY IN TEN DAYS "a delight"?

Linn1
03-14-2007, 04:21 AM
to writing an angry response in their review forum about that review when I saw it earlier today. I held back only because it's so typical that I figured fans would not take it seriously. First off, considering we're dealing with a film that even the original production company doesn't have a copy of, I would cut it a bit of slack look-wise considering this is most likely the only release you'll ever see of the movie. That said, the dvd looks fine, and better than the last few Crash releases IMO. The idea that you can compare these releases with the best of the best video and audio-wise is a bit much.

As for the film itself, everything the writer cites as an issue is what makes the film unique as Von said. The only thing I can agree with the writer on is the subs which are smaller than usual. But to cite the fact that ,"The print used still contains the same burned-in subtitles (in both Chinese and English) that likely accompanied the film on its original release.", as if it's something to count against it is over the top.

Edit-I changed my mind: Sword response (http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7708898#post7708898)

The Running Man
03-14-2007, 06:46 PM
Edit-I changed my mind:

Go get'em Linn.
;)

ironfistedmonk2003
03-14-2007, 07:34 PM
Touche :D

Knetan
03-14-2007, 08:37 PM
hey,

isn't there a press release in circulation where Crash ARE claiming that they've basically done what they can given the source? Read something somewhere....but can't remember where now.

th33 lightning fists
03-14-2007, 09:06 PM
Here's info (http://www.crashmediagroupinc.com/crashcinema/IronM.pdf) on the process as done to Iron Mistress (http://www.crashmediagroupinc.com/ditsinf/Crash_IronMistress.pdf) aka Iron Petticoat.

Crash's myspace has a more detailed (http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=57547682&blogID=226398439&MyToken=07241e08-cfe0-482a-8072-e7f4041031a5) technical entry.

I'm sure these press releases went out to DVD Talk as well.

gfanikf
03-14-2007, 10:47 PM
I've been talking with James at Crash. An actual review (excluding the ones on this board) should be up by the end of the week as my copies should arrive soon :) .

EDIT: Nice one Linn :)

VonHumboldtFleischer
03-14-2007, 11:09 PM
Thanks for the links to the technical info, lightning. I'm one of those ignorant people who tend to think that you just have to take an old 35mm and "run it through a machine", press the 'remaster' button, and voila! A remastered DVD.

I think that this is part of the problem, though, with DVD reviews that complain about speckles, low contrast, etc. The people who write them are just as ignorant as I am about the amount of work involved in getting a watchable DVD out of a worn, speckled, washed-out 35mm print (or 1" video tape, or U-Matic, or what-have-you), so they expect that new releases on DVD have been "run through the machine" that magically makes them as crisp and 5.1-friendly as the latest Disney Pixar piece of crap.

All the same, it does make Celestial's efforts seem all the more impressive. Picture-wise, at least. The audio content is another, slightly more controversial, story.

Tosh
03-14-2007, 11:59 PM
Edit-I changed my mind:

:rollin I love how this guy starts talking about how the plot didn't work for him, man he didn't even watch it.
At least he gave you props Linn, he knew better:evil

Linn1
03-15-2007, 01:31 AM
I've never talked to David Cornelius, but he added a classy post-script to his review:

Note: For an interesting rebuttal, please visit this forum. The reader, unhappy with my opinion on the film, offers a portrait of the movie as an important work in the history of the genre. It's good stuff.

Got to say, that was a nice thing to do.

limubai2000
03-15-2007, 03:43 AM
Now maybe David would be so nice as to re-review the disk in light of your added information Linn? I read your comment and his also, very classy.

Lei Kung
03-15-2007, 04:39 AM
Way to go Linn. You put the smack down. Can't say enough good things about your knowledge of the genre.
Linn (and kung fu fans): 1
Ignorance: 0

saltysam
03-15-2007, 02:58 PM
Hi All....got the dvd today and psted some caps over at bulletsnbabes if you want a look :)

www.bulletsnbabesdvd.com/...6559#76559 (http://www.bulletsnbabesdvd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=76559#76559)

The Running Man
03-16-2007, 06:42 PM
You know, I have to agree with one thing that the DVD Talk reviewer commented on, and that was about the subtitles. He makes a very good point that Crash should have included an optional sub track to watch the film with seeing as how the subtitles on the print itself were largely illegible thanks to how the white font blended in with the scenery most of the time.

And another criticism I do have with the transfer is why it wasn't encoded as progressive video? Seems to me to be a waste of a high def remastered transfer to just do the video as interlaced really.

chen lung
03-16-2007, 07:03 PM
Seems to me to be a waste of a high def remastered transfer to just do the video as interlaced really.
Windowboxing does my nut in.

The Running Man
03-16-2007, 07:23 PM
:lol

morgoth
03-16-2007, 07:40 PM
I can't wait to watch this movie this weekend. I skimmed through for a minute or 2 to see how the picture is. It looks pretty specked at the start, but it looks good to me.

VonHumboldtFleischer
03-16-2007, 09:10 PM
You know, I have to agree with one thing that the DVD Talk reviewer commented on, and that was about the subtitles. He makes a very good point that Crash should have included an optional sub track to watch the film with seeing as how the subtitles on the print itself were largely illegible thanks to how the white font blended in with the scenery most of the time.


Have you ever seen subtitles superimposed over subtitles? It's a one-way ticket to a throbbing migraine and temporary insanity.

killer meteor
03-16-2007, 10:29 PM
You could put the optional subs in the bottom black bar or in a black box over the burnt in subs. I've been suggesting this for years but subtitles cost a lot more than I realised

spannick
03-16-2007, 10:45 PM
yeah, Soulblade did this with their UNICORN FIST DVD. optional Subs in the Black Bar, Burn Subs on the Print...

chen lung
03-16-2007, 11:03 PM
: lol
What was funny:\ ?

The Running Man
03-16-2007, 11:58 PM
Have you ever seen subtitles superimposed over subtitles? It's a one-way ticket to a throbbing migraine and temporary insanity.

I'll point to killer meteor's post:

You could put the optional subs in the bottom black bar or in a black box over the burnt in subs.

::Nods in agreement with killer meteor:: :)

chen lung
03-17-2007, 12:02 AM
I have to laugh at my attempt to quote an emoticon:lol .

VonHumboldtFleischer
03-17-2007, 12:21 AM
ou could put the optional subs in the bottom black bar or in a black box over the burnt in subs.

Wouldn't two sets of subtitles (three, if you include the Chinese) be a little cluttered? Also, if the DVD is anamorphic and you're watching it on a widescreen TV, won't the subs appear over the existing subs anyway?

An opaque black box with the new subs over the existing ones seems the least obtrusive solution, but even that will rob you of some of the picture. Still, if you MUST have perfectly legible subs, that's the kind of thing you have to live with.

The Running Man
03-17-2007, 12:57 AM
Honestly, in a situation like this you're damned if you do and damned if you don't.

But at least if subs were placed on top of the image, in a black space to cover the original subs, at least you can read the translation whereas with the original subs you can't all the time.

VonHumboldtFleischer
03-17-2007, 01:08 AM
Honestly, in a situation like this you're damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Well, that's true enough.

I don't think I have any DVDs with subtitles over subtitles, as far as I'm aware. So I noodled about a bit with this screen cap from THE MASTER STRIKES BACK just to get an idea of what they might look like.

Here's one with the subs in the black area:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/misterdeeds/mission1.jpg

It's very cluttered looking, I think. And as I said, they might disappear altogether on a widescreen TV.

Here's what it would look like with a black bar:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/misterdeeds/mission2.jpg

Much cleaner and clearer, I think. But it's possible that some small part of the action could be obscured entirely by the bar. I remember a projectionist once framed out the bottom of the screen during a showing of CASABLANCA, making the scene where Ingrid Bergman draws a gun on Bogart completely unintelligible.

There's also the question of resizing the bar with every subtitle, which for some reason strikes me as immensely complicated. But then, I don't know how the radio works.

Anyway, like you say, you can't really win, and there's no solution that's 100% perfect.

th33 lightning fists
03-19-2007, 04:04 PM
On my run of the mill Toshiba 32inch (I think I’ll be able to afford an HDTV when I’m dead), the window boxing is indiscernible, and I only notice it if I watch the DVD on my computer. Noticing how close some of the subs came to the right edge of the screen, I’m glad they did whatever they did and didn’t cut them off.

Putting 2 rows of subs on a DVD messes my head up since try as I might there’s always that distraction of your eye hitting both of them in that 1.5 seconds that you have to read the line and look at what’s going on. Plus, when the subtitles get a little Engrish-like I can’t imagine using the word for word transcription in the digital ones... what would be funny, but not something a company could get away with I think. The only real way to fix prints with burnt-in subs is for someone to go in and digitally stroke all the subs in a dark color for contrast. But that kind of thing needs to be done by hand and the only people I know who can do that charge by the hour and it’s not pretty.

morgoth
03-19-2007, 09:03 PM
Even though the subs are hard to read to say the least, the story is still pretty easy to follow. I thought it was a good flick. Certainly not your average kung fu tale.

Markgway
03-19-2007, 10:30 PM
I don't like two sets of subs. Distracting. Either burnt or remastered but not both together.

HwangDi
03-20-2007, 05:29 AM
Just got done watching The Sword tonight. Hard to follow the burnt in subtitles but the story keeps you hooked till the end. The film is very cold and dark, there's nothing really quite like this story that I've ever seen.

FarEastPirate
03-20-2007, 01:21 PM
if you make the subs in yellow with a nice shadow around the yellow you wont strain your eyes on the burnt in subs, becuase the bright yellow will overide the blurry faded white subs.

PS i did that with the LBX Valiant ones and i had no complaints

Knetan
03-20-2007, 03:14 PM
hey,

who came up with the "Money talks, nigga" subtitle on The Valiant Ones dvd? :rollin

gfanikf
03-20-2007, 05:32 PM
WHAT?? Can you post a cap of that?

Knetan
03-20-2007, 06:34 PM
hey,

I've since passed it on after cleaning up the subs (from mostly poor grammar to acceptable standard for me) but I'm telling you, it IS there.

The Running Man
03-21-2007, 01:21 AM
Putting 2 rows of subs on a DVD messes my head up since try as I might there’s always that distraction of your eye hitting both of them in that 1.5 seconds that you have to read the line and look at what’s going on.

I don't like two sets of subs. Distracting. Either burnt or remastered but not both together.

You guys do realize there is a second option right? It's pretty much been agreed upon that having two sets of subs on screen at the same time is not the best idea.

Plus, when the subtitles get a little Engrish-like I can’t imagine using the word for word transcription in the digital ones... what would be funny, but not something a company could get away with I think.

Obviously that wouldn't make it's way to the final draft. Person typing it can just fix the grammar, wording, etc...

th33 lightning fists
03-21-2007, 02:01 PM
Obviously that wouldn't make it's way to the final draft. Person typing it can just fix the grammar, wording, etc...

So there would be 2 different lines of English text in the same frame? That's too distracting.

The whole root of the peoblem is that the subs that are nor up to par are the ones that can't be removed.

killer meteor
03-21-2007, 02:30 PM
Just have them over the originals in a black box - optional, of course

The Running Man
03-21-2007, 06:56 PM
So there would be 2 different lines of English text in the same frame? That's too distracting.

Huh??

Who's talking about have 2 different lines of English text at the same time?

th33 lightning fists
03-22-2007, 07:36 PM
Obviously that wouldn't make it's way to the final draft. Person typing it can just fix the grammar, wording, etc...

Doesn't that mean that the new subs wouldn't match up with the burnt in ones? If the burnt in ones aren't blacked out then that would be too confusing.

The Running Man
03-22-2007, 09:26 PM
It seems you are thinking about the timing of the subtitles. I was talking about that. :)

Isfahani
03-23-2007, 03:02 AM
The only dvd I have with the black bar over the subs is the infamous "Incubus" (starrin W Shatner and shot entirely in esperanto)... This was thought lost until they found a French subbed print of it... Not the most optimal but it works, and i'd vote for this method.

However, any way you look at it, it's an additional expense to the producers.

iron flag
03-25-2007, 03:47 PM
Worst subtitles I've seen in a while...I got a headache after 15 minutes. How can they call it "digitally remastered"? I'd rather see it raw. Good movie though.

fabhui
03-25-2007, 07:25 PM
Just got through watching this one today and have to say the subs weren't quite as bad as what as I was expecting or maybe I'm just used to watching movies that are only available as 6th or 7th gen copies. When it came to the picture quality I was very impressed considering the conditions that these movies were found in.

As for the movie itself...WOW! This is now my favourite Wang Yu movie and easily in my top 5 wuxia movies. It's got everything, a great story, good performances, a top notch score, great fight sequences and oodles of atmosphere!!

I only watched it a couple of hours ago and I'm already wanting another viewing of the movie! :D

morgoth
03-25-2007, 07:58 PM
Wang Yu is pretty awesome in this movie. It may be his best performance.

Subs didn't bother me much and the story is easy enough to follow.

th33 lightning fists
03-27-2007, 03:09 PM
Worst subtitles I've seen in a while...I got a headache after 15 minutes. How can they call it "digitally remastered"? I'd rather see it raw. Good movie though.


I wonder how one would "digitally remaster" non digital subtiles?

Linn1
03-27-2007, 03:26 PM
every dvd is digitally mastered. If a company changes anything at all dealing with the way a film looks, it's considered remastered. In this case, they did color correct the print, which is more than most companies do when adding the remastered tag. Considering what they had to work with, it's a good job IMO.

The Running Man
03-27-2007, 08:03 PM
Hey Linn, did you get to check out the other releases from this line? I know they have at least one other DVD out which I saw at a store not too long ago.

iron flag
03-28-2007, 12:10 AM
I realize they are burned in subs :| I was just expecting better (like removable or whatever) The picture looked great, just those white subs on white blow. Luckily the movie isn't that hard to follow.Now that I think of it SatCM was also remastered and the subs were bad too.

tigerstyles
03-28-2007, 11:53 AM
just got my copy along with Enter the Dragon HD,.. yeah

will watch this afternoon. looks mint..kinda like the old burnt in subs authentic style

Knetan
03-28-2007, 02:27 PM
hey,

indeed, tigerstyles. Doubt there should be any problems with this one. Seen far worse, and gotten through far worse.

The Running Man
03-28-2007, 06:13 PM
The only times I have ever seen far worse than this are on old cropped to full screen prints of films.

For widescreen presentations, this is as bad as it gets really.

Linn1
03-29-2007, 03:05 AM
For widescreen presentations, this is as bad as it gets really.

I've seen FAR FAR worse for widescreen prints. From purple or green subs to subtitles half the size of the ones on The Sword. Those made the ones here look like remastered, removable type. As for the other titles, I've seen the other two. They are about the same quality as the others in the line.

Knetan
03-29-2007, 09:29 AM
hey,

now that's just overeacting, Running Man. You're telling me you won't be able to adjust to these after sitting with the film just a few minutes in? White on white is one thing but to call these original, lovely non-retranslated subs "as bad as it gets" is just silly. Linn's right, it gets far, far worse.

With cinema such as this, and in general sometimes, you should be very glad to settle for less. What this line promises is pure heaven I think, especially as a new viewer of these previously obscure ones.

Goldenswallow06
03-29-2007, 11:39 AM
Eh, people are moaning about this release? What's the world coming to?

A lovely, clean, widescreen print of a truly classic, rare film at a budget price, props to Crash! I just hope they bring us many more releases of this standard!!!

Robert Ian Teller
03-29-2007, 02:29 PM
Yeah I agree I've seen far worse subtitles. Don't know what the problem is, maybe some people here weren't around during the vhs days? :rollin

The Running Man
03-29-2007, 02:40 PM
I've seen FAR FAR worse for widescreen prints. From purple or green subs to subtitles half the size of the ones on The Sword. Those made the ones here look like remastered, removable type.

When you have to adjust you're tv set just to try to make out the subtitles Linn, that's pretty bad. It's not good or classic or whatever. It's bad. You've actually seen worse? God bless you then man. But that doesn't change that the situation here is bad.

Now, let me explain further because people tend to not get the whole message for whatever reason and create a situation where I have to keep on repeating myself over, and over, and over again and sometimes they still don't get it:

I understand that this is the only print that was found for the movie and obviously, nothing can be done about the subtitles on screen. I am only stressing my point that Crash should have included optional subtitles akin to something I suggested so that it can help viewers not have to be distracted with the existing subtitles when trying to watch the film.

Notice, there are far bigger problems with this release. The video for example is real inconsistent stuff, and if a proper remastering process was done half the problems on the video wouldn't exist. Just seems to me a very light and inexpensive procedure was done to this. Sound is also a problem with no real clean-up done to it.

But am I bringing all of these problems to light? No, because the release is from Crash who I honestly don't expect much of a real remastered release from and on top of that, I have seen copies of movies that were in far worse condition than this so I can live with that no problem. I just concentrate on the subtitles cause that's something that at least they could have done something about on the budget they have. It would have helped. That's all I'm saying. :)

Linn1
03-29-2007, 02:51 PM
as I said in the original post I made, that was the only issue I had with the release as well. I agree that the subs are pretty bad and that something should have been done. The main issue is all these releases have a VERY strict release window. So much so, Crash have enough time to just make sure the print looks good before it gets put out. I think they had very little time to think about the subs in this case. Maybe, if this gets a HD re-release in the future, something can be done. As I told Crash, I can see something with subs this severe turning off average fans. All that said, I'm very happy to see a release at all.

The Running Man
03-29-2007, 03:02 PM
Thanks for understanding Linn. :)

I don't mind these movies getting released, it's great they are, but just a little extra mile I wish was gone for the subtitles would have made the releases more valuable and help reach a wider audience.

In fact, considering the importance you stress that this film is in the wu xia genre, would it have been out of the question for you to provide some sort of notes for the release so a bit of historical background could have been provided on it?

What about the other films coming out? How are they?

Linn1
03-29-2007, 03:42 PM
In fact, considering the importance you stress that this film is in the wu xia genre, would it have been out of the question for you to provide some sort of notes for the release so a bit of historical background could have been provided on it?

but the dvd was done before I was talking to Crash about these releases.

tigerstyles
03-29-2007, 06:31 PM
even maybe a small sample of Wang Yus blood as an extra contained in a small yet inoffensive packet..

jeeze you dont' want much do you Running Man

these titles are rare!

The Running Man
03-29-2007, 06:49 PM
make the effort to stay on the same level here, otherwise it kinda makes it difficult to take your comments seriously ya know? :b

GwaiLoMoFo
03-30-2007, 04:13 AM
Picked up this dvd today and Im satisfied with it. Not Celestial quality, but better than I expected (alot better than past Crash releases). And it only cost $10, also better than previous inferior Crash releases for $15. But by putting "Digitally Remastered" on the cover they set our expectations high. Rarescope does it right by stating "Every effort has been made to find the best possible source for this DVD" on the back of their covers.


BTW, anybody got some reviews for the other recent Crash releases (Broken Sword, Beautiful Swordswoman, Knight Of Old Cathay)? The trailer for Beautiful Swordswomen looked terrible (imo). Knight Of Old Cathay looked ok.

limubai2000
03-30-2007, 05:39 AM
All you guys are making an issue where IMHO none exists. The only copy of Sword going around was a widescreen copy cropped to fullscreen missing half of it's subtitles! This copy is far better. For this film it probably won't get any better than this unless someone finds a pristine mint copy without the burnt subs, which probably won't happen.

Sometimes some of you need to chill the hell out and realize not every release can be perfect when the film print SIMPLY DOES NOT EXIST to be able to provide that. Seriously it's a an old movie, made in a country notorious for not preserving it's original film stock, in a genre which isn't exactly sitting on every household's DVD shelf, and maybe some of you guys need to realize these facts and appreciate what Crash was able to deliver into our hands.

Oh yes, this is Wang Yu's best overall role IMHO. Great film.

- end rant

Isfahani
03-30-2007, 05:53 AM
^ what he said. who's the fanboi on the block now?

lol

killer meteor
03-30-2007, 10:09 AM
I agree with Running Man: companies should make the effort to have optional new subs that help people to understand the story better.

The Running Man
03-30-2007, 01:30 PM
Sometimes some of you need to chill the hell out and realize not every release can be perfect

Ok, now go back to this thread and find me where someone demanded that.

Robert Ian Teller
03-30-2007, 04:12 PM
Not to point any fingers at anybody or anything. But in general I personally feel there has been a bit too much complaining on this board during the last few months.

We all have our own preferences. But some of our demands are (unfortunately) unrealistic considering the circumstances.

Lot of these films are rare, pretty dirt cheap and are actually coming out legit. This is a niche market folks not the type of stuff big studios are gonna put out in all the markets pushing a million units a title.

The Running Man
03-30-2007, 04:16 PM
No, what is happening is some people take any sort of complaint and take it to the moon and back with over the top comments claiming that others are demanding unrealistic things when no such thing is taking place. In other words, people aren't reading what others are saying. They just type comments that are exaggerating what's going on.

I'm gonna ask you what I asked limubai2000: Find me one place in this thread where someone asked for something "unrealistic".

limubai2000
03-31-2007, 12:10 AM
"unrealistic".

Apparently some fans don't live in reality. Crash released this film, the same Crash that sometimes we wonder if they went bankrupt and disappeared Crash? The same Crash whose idea of remastering means they blew the dust off the print with their own hot air coz they can't afford compressed air cannisters? The same Crash who releases a lot of non-legit stuff?

There is realistic = big company X who has tons of cash and can do just about anything they want to a DVD release should have done X... like DD, Image or Fox.

Then there is realistic = small company Y who barely scrapes along who has very little cash and struggles to get DVDs out the door and sold should have done X... like Crash.

Big difference there. Crash does not have the money to do the kind of complete remastering people are complaining about, they obviously don't have the money to do a lot of what they COULD do to remaster these films. To recognize this fact and appreciate the fact that we hold a MUCH BETTER legit copy of this film in our hands on DVD than we had before is very cool IMHO.

If you're in the "I complain about every release camp" I believe the word used in other parts of the internet is "fanboy", normally with a negative connotation.

And my comment was not directed at you in particular RM, it was a general comment directed at the forum. I buried the hatchet with you a long time ago and outright praised a few things you wrote lately. If you took it personally then you missed the spirit in which it was intended.

I really would hate to be Linn sometimes, it looks to me like he bears the brunt of fanboys who complain so much about these releases and suggest this that and the Easter Bunny when the simple fact of the matter is that Linn doesn't control any of these companies, I'm sure they hear his input coming from fanboys but they don't have the time, money or inclination in some cases.

I guess the root of my complaint here is all the negativity around here lately as noted by another post. I see a thread like this eviscerating Crash who we all know isn't a cash rich company but I see no positive threads about how good the Fusian disks appear to be (thanks for the caps gfan). This forum is getting more depressing by the month, sheesh no wonder I'm moving to China in the fall!!!!! :p

iron flag
03-31-2007, 12:42 AM
Since when is it taboo too gripe about something just because we've "seen worse"? I've watched crappy, god knows how many generation, copies with cut off subtitles too. Sounds like the people getting touchy are the ones not complaining! :) If having seen worse is our criteria its not setting the bar very high (especially in this genre!) Gwailo kind of summed up my opinion.

HAZ74
03-31-2007, 12:47 AM
It wouldn't be a bid deal for someone to type the subs out & make a srt file. I edit my subs all the time - change fonts, colors. If its so bad & the movie is raer, it would take much. I'll prolly do it when I get my copy.

The Running Man
03-31-2007, 01:51 AM
And my comment was not directed at you in particular RM, it was a general comment directed at the forum. I buried the hatchet with you a long time ago and outright praised a few things you wrote lately. If you took it personally then you missed the spirit in which it was intended.

Then perhaps it would have been better to either save the comment to a debate that was more in synch with your message, or just make a seperate thread about what you wanted to talk about. Cause see the thing is you posted this in this thread after comments were made specifically about me.

So can you blame me?

Linn1
03-31-2007, 03:08 AM
everyone here is a fan. But please don't forget were also by definition fanatics as well. We all would LOVE for every company under the sun to do a multi-million restoration to every film. But that can't happen. That said, a subtitle track is something that is very easy to do and not in the same realm as a complete remaster. But then how to do the subtitle track then would come under fire, as we see here. :)

But to be honest, Crash wasn't aware of the import of film at the time they were prepping it, nor did they have the time to really do much prior to it's release. These titles have been pre-sold and have places waiting on them, something that is required when you're doing such a large undertaking as this. When a company can't even send out stills of a film in advance of a release to help identify what the film is, that should tell you the company is working under a VERY fast turn around rate. If a company simply halts production of a title in this situation, and stiffs their stores, there's a good chance when that title comes around again, the stores will pass on carrying it. No matter what the reason it was canceled.

I think part of the issue with some fans hating complaints is that they believe this will turn off other fans,sometimes even the companies themselves, from buying a title, equaling less titles for us all in the long run. This is even more of an issue with a small company that we're nervous may not hold up. I think it must be said, EVERY fan that has seen this movie has agreed it is a good/great film. At the end of the day, when it comes to fans, the film, not the subtitles will always win out. The very fact that many of us have seen FAR worse copies of films, and watched them sometimes repeatedly, bears this out. :)

All of that said, everyone has different standards and expectations. And this is the place to voice them. Partly because the company may read it and note it for future releases, and partly because that's the point of this board, for people to write what they think. If they didn't, and we didn't argue once in a while, it would be pretty bland IMO. And honestly, we wouldn't see any change in the statius quo, so complaining about things isn't the worst thing in the world. As for if I get tired of it, kinda. But I get FAR more tired of companies (not speaking of Crash here) not paying any attention to what people who are their guarantied sale have to say about these releases.

tigerstyles
03-31-2007, 10:57 AM
This forum is getting more depressing by the month

well said! also Asian DVD guide is also getting the same.

The Running Man
03-31-2007, 02:26 PM
We all would LOVE for every company under the sun to do a multi-million restoration to every film. But that can't happen.

Linn, we're going around in circles here. NO ONE in this thread requested such a thing. When it was made clear that this is so far the only print available, that was understood. No one was or has said otherwise.

Just as I have said before, no one's reading anything. Someone sees a compliant and they go over the top complaining about others complaining. After a while it sounds as if they are talking about other things entirely and others who come into the forum and read these replies think that something along those lines is happening when nothing of the sort is going on.

well said! also Asian DVD guide is also getting the same.

tigerstyles, stop acting like a dick.

HAZ74
03-31-2007, 05:40 PM
Could have been better, but waaaaay better than nothing. Its as simple as that. All this sparing is NAGL.

Linn1
03-31-2007, 08:42 PM
Linn, we're going around in circles here. NO ONE in this thread requested such a thing.

Nor did I say anyone did. I was speaking in general that "we," fandom, would like to see these all remastered.

limubai2000
03-31-2007, 11:10 PM
tigerstyles, stop acting like a dick.

I don't see how it's my fault that you RM have a defensive personality.

You very elegantly proved tiger's and my point. :p

Lei Kung
04-01-2007, 02:47 AM
It's funny to see how this thread evolved. It almost has a plot. Anyway, I thought for sure that Linn's comment at the end of page 4 was the end, but no.. another twist. Maybe it's time to close this topic.

The Running Man
04-01-2007, 05:26 AM
You very elegantly proved tiger's and my point.

I don't know what point that was, seeing as my comment towards him was because of the almost all the comments he has made both in this and the Asian DVD Guide forums.

Shaolin Dog Paw
04-01-2007, 02:56 PM
http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/5044/hirokomorihc6.jpg

Isfahani
04-02-2007, 09:27 AM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v105/isfahani/8dba9cb9.jpg

killer meteor
04-02-2007, 12:12 PM
Now there's something you don't see every day

bobo
04-02-2007, 01:18 PM
HTML Comments are not allowed

tigerstyles
04-02-2007, 03:06 PM
i wonder if some of you guys actualy enjoy the films these days instead of just ripping them apart for faults..lighten up guys

morgoth
04-03-2007, 05:59 AM
Are we allowed to talk about the movie yet?

The Running Man
04-03-2007, 07:06 PM
Just make a thread about the movie then. :b

Linn1
04-03-2007, 10:02 PM
there appeared to be one for a while there. Feel free to start another.